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This guy got more fame and money by writing a song about his experience with United.<br>United did pay attention to him when he got more than a million hits...<br><br>It is on YouTube:<br><br><h1><font style="font-size: 10pt;" size="2">United Breaks Guitars<br>http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5YGc4zOqozo</font></h1>Perhaps getting more creative may be the better alternative....<br><br><br>David C. Brown, PMP<br>- Computer Forensics Investigator / CISSP (in training)<br>- Web site and application development<br>- Six Sigma Certified Professional<br>- Security+, CCNA, MCSE, MCDBA, MCSD <br>- 412.357.0266<br><br><br><br><br><br><br><br>> From: wplug-request@wplug.org<br>> Subject: wplug Digest, Vol 67, Issue 7<br>> To: wplug@wplug.org<br>> Date: Thu, 10 Sep 2009 12:00:03 -0400<br>> <br>> Send wplug mailing list submissions to<br>> wplug@wplug.org<br>> <br>> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit<br>> http://www.wplug.org/mailman/listinfo/wplug<br>> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to<br>> wplug-request@wplug.org<br>> <br>> You can reach the person managing the list at<br>> wplug-owner@wplug.org<br>> <br>> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific<br>> than "Re: Contents of wplug digest..."<br>> <br>> <br>> Today's Topics:<br>> <br>> 1. DNS law? (Douglas Green)<br>> 2. Re: DNS law? (Zachary Uram)<br>> 3. Re: DNS law? (Mackenzie Morgan)<br>> 4. Re: DNS law? (George Larson)<br>> 5. Re: DNS law? (Tim Lesher)<br>> 6. Re: DNS law? (Bill Moran)<br>> 7. Re: DNS law? (Yaakov Nemoy)<br>> 8. Re: DNS law? (Bill Moran)<br>> 9. Re: WiFi Parts Pgh (Christopher DeMarco)<br>> 10. Re: DNS law? (Christopher DeMarco)<br>> 11. Re: DNS law? (Drew from Zhrodague)<br>> 12. Re: DNS law? (Bill Moran)<br>> 13. Re: DNS law? (Pat Barron)<br>> 14. Re: DNS law? (Michael Semcheski)<br>> 15. Re: DNS law? (Zachary Uram)<br>> <br>> <br>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------<br>> <br>> Message: 1<br>> Date: Wed, 09 Sep 2009 18:14:23 -0700<br>> From: Douglas Green <diego96@mac.com><br>> Subject: [wplug] DNS law?<br>> To: General user list <wplug@wplug.org><br>> Message-ID: <81BFF9F4-6AC8-4AE0-8DD9-84B35B2D8A36@mac.com><br>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed; delsp=yes<br>> <br>> Hi Group-<br>> <br>> I understand that I'm not consulting an attorney by addressing your <br>> guys, and that your opinions don't constitute legal advice, etc. <br>> Nevertheless, many of you are pretty well informed regarding internet <br>> and The Law. Besides that, you're all pretty sharp.<br>> <br>> Some weeks ago I had a horrible customer experience with an airline. <br>> My issues were completely ignored by customer service, who actually <br>> didn't return email or phone calls. My final step was to register a <br>> domain name and put up a website, documenting the problems I've <br>> experienced with this airline.<br>> <br>> The airline owns "theirname".com.mx, but does not own "theirname".com, <br>> which is owned by some other travel-related company. I was able to <br>> purchase "theirname".us, just in time for them announcing US flight <br>> servce (previously, they only operated within Mexico).<br>> <br>> Today I got a cease/desist letter from a legal firm out of New York <br>> stating that my website is defamatory, and that I must immediately <br>> remove the website content AND give the airline company the Domain <br>> Name!!!<br>> <br>> It's this second point that I'm asking your opinions on- If I own <br>> airline.us, do I have to hand over the DNS to airline.com.mx who <br>> apparently failed to secure the top domain space despite their <br>> "tradename"? As far as the content being defamatory, AFIK if it's True <br>> then it ain't Slander!<br>> <br>> Thanks for your (non-legally binding) input! ;)<br>> -Doug<br>> <br>> PS- For the morbidly curious: www.volaris.us<br>> <br>> <br>> ------------------------------<br>> <br>> Message: 2<br>> Date: Wed, 9 Sep 2009 22:37:36 -0400<br>> From: Zachary Uram <netrek@gmail.com><br>> Subject: Re: [wplug] DNS law?<br>> To: General user list <wplug@wplug.org><br>> Message-ID:<br>> <ecfa260c0909091937p5df33875w398bf502155751c4@mail.gmail.com><br>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8<br>> <br>> Contact a lawyer. You get what you pay for in such matters is my<br>> experience. Whatever the letter of the law may be this is relatively<br>> new case law and a good attorney could make a huge difference,<br>> especially since the airline likely has much deeper legal pockets than<br>> yourself. You must also weigh how much this is worth to you. To<br>> litigate this case may be very expensive.<br>> <br>> Zach<br>> <br>> On Wed, Sep 9, 2009 at 9:14 PM, Douglas Green<diego96@mac.com> wrote:<br>> > Hi Group-<br>> ><br>> > I understand that I'm not consulting an attorney by addressing your<br>> > guys, and that your opinions don't constitute legal advice, etc.<br>> > Nevertheless, many of you are pretty well informed regarding internet<br>> > and The Law. Besides that, you're all pretty sharp.<br>> ><br>> > Some weeks ago I had a horrible customer experience with an airline.<br>> > My issues were completely ignored by customer service, who actually<br>> > didn't return email or phone calls. My final step was to register a<br>> > domain name and put up a website, documenting the problems I've<br>> > experienced with this airline.<br>> ><br>> > The airline owns "theirname".com.mx, but does not own "theirname".com,<br>> > which is owned by some other travel-related company. I was able to<br>> > purchase "theirname".us, just in time for them announcing US flight<br>> > servce (previously, they only operated within Mexico).<br>> ><br>> > Today I got a cease/desist letter from a legal firm out of New York<br>> > stating that my website is defamatory, and that I must immediately<br>> > remove the website content AND give the airline company the Domain<br>> > Name!!!<br>> ><br>> > It's this second point that I'm asking your opinions on- If I own<br>> > airline.us, do I have to hand over the DNS to airline.com.mx who<br>> > apparently failed to secure the top domain space despite their<br>> > "tradename"? As far as the content being defamatory, AFIK if it's True<br>> > then it ain't Slander!<br>> ><br>> > Thanks for your (non-legally binding) input! ;)<br>> > -Doug<br>> ><br>> > PS- For the morbidly curious: www.volaris.us<br>> > _______________________________________________<br>> > wplug mailing list<br>> > wplug@wplug.org<br>> > http://www.wplug.org/mailman/listinfo/wplug<br>> ><br>> <br>> <br>> ------------------------------<br>> <br>> Message: 3<br>> Date: Wed, 9 Sep 2009 23:39:18 -0400<br>> From: Mackenzie Morgan <macoafi@gmail.com><br>> Subject: Re: [wplug] DNS law?<br>> To: wplug@wplug.org<br>> Message-ID: <200909092339.18709.macoafi@gmail.com><br>> Content-Type: Text/Plain; charset="iso-8859-1"<br>> <br>> On Wednesday 09 September 2009 9:14:23 pm Douglas Green wrote:<br>> > Today I got a cease/desist letter from a legal firm out of New York<br>> > stating that my website is defamatory, and that I must immediately<br>> > remove the website content AND give the airline company the Domain<br>> > Name!!!<br>> > <br>> > It's this second point that I'm asking your opinions on- If I own<br>> > airline.us, do I have to hand over the DNS to airline.com.mx who<br>> > apparently failed to secure the top domain space despite their<br>> > "tradename"? As far as the content being defamatory, AFIK if it's True<br>> > then it ain't Slander!<br>> <br>> Yeah, pretty sure they can demand the domain name if they've trademarked it. <br>> However, THEIRNAMEsucks.com ... well...that'd be safe for you to buy.<br>> <br>> -- <br>> Mackenzie Morgan<br>> http://ubuntulinuxtipstricks.blogspot.com<br>> apt-get moo<br>> <br>> <br>> ------------------------------<br>> <br>> Message: 4<br>> Date: Thu, 10 Sep 2009 06:58:33 -0400<br>> From: George Larson <george.g.larson@gmail.com><br>> Subject: Re: [wplug] DNS law?<br>> To: General user list <wplug@wplug.org><br>> Message-ID:<br>> <a623739c0909100358t4a063d5bwa79fd85c5310dd38@mail.gmail.com><br>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1<br>> <br>> On Wed, Sep 9, 2009 at 11:39 PM, Mackenzie Morgan<macoafi@gmail.com> wrote:<br>> > On Wednesday 09 September 2009 9:14:23 pm Douglas Green wrote:<br>> >> Today I got a cease/desist letter from a legal firm out of New York<br>> >> stating that my website is defamatory, and that I must immediately<br>> >> remove the website content AND give the airline company the Domain<br>> >> Name!!!<br>> >><br>> >> It's this second point that I'm asking your opinions on- If I own<br>> >> airline.us, do I have to hand over the DNS to airline.com.mx who<br>> >> apparently failed to secure the top domain space despite their<br>> >> "tradename"? As far as the content being defamatory, AFIK if it's True<br>> >> then it ain't Slander!<br>> ><br>> > Yeah, pretty sure they can demand the domain name if they've trademarked it.<br>> > However, ?THEIRNAMEsucks.com ... well...that'd be safe for you to buy.<br>> ><br>> > --<br>> > Mackenzie Morgan<br>> > http://ubuntulinuxtipstricks.blogspot.com<br>> > apt-get moo<br>> > _______________________________________________<br>> > wplug mailing list<br>> > wplug@wplug.org<br>> > http://www.wplug.org/mailman/listinfo/wplug<br>> ><br>> <br>> 10 US Laws Every Domainer Needs to Know [<br>> http://www.avivadirectory.com/domain-law/ ]<br>> <br>> If we assume that site is credible, it looks like they can demand<br>> their trademarked name.<br>> <br>> <br>> ------------------------------<br>> <br>> Message: 5<br>> Date: Thu, 10 Sep 2009 07:28:34 -0400<br>> From: Tim Lesher <tlesher@gmail.com><br>> Subject: Re: [wplug] DNS law?<br>> To: General user list <wplug@wplug.org><br>> Message-ID:<br>> <9613db600909100428v4f511f54w1cc5490e001e2db@mail.gmail.com><br>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"<br>> <br>> On Wed, Sep 9, 2009 at 21:14, Douglas Green <diego96@mac.com> wrote:<br>> <br>> > Hi Group-<br>> ><br>> > I understand that I'm not consulting an attorney by addressing your<br>> > guys, and that your opinions don't constitute legal advice, etc.<br>> > Nevertheless, many of you are pretty well informed regarding internet<br>> > and The Law. Besides that, you're all pretty sharp.<br>> ><br>> ><br>> [standard IANAL disclaimer applies]<br>> <br>> Outside of the allegation of defamation, you're in ICANN dispute resolution<br>> territory:<br>> <br>> http://www.icann.org/en/udrp/udrp.htm<br>> <br>> The short version is that when you register a domain name, you are<br>> representing to the registrar that the domain name you register does not, to<br>> the best of your ability, infringe on anyone else's rights (including<br>> trademark). That's been the case for the past 10 years.<br>> <br>> A C&D is usually just the first line of defense (primarily because it's the<br>> least expensive option for the trademark holder); after that, it gets real<br>> legal real fast.<br>> <br>> Even shorter version: if you do intend to refuse the request, talk to a<br>> lawyer.<br>> <br>> <br>> <br>> -- <br>> Tim Lesher <tlesher@gmail.com><br>> -------------- next part --------------<br>> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...<br>> URL: http://www.wplug.org/pipermail/wplug/attachments/20090910/2fd3818c/attachment-0001.html <br>> <br>> ------------------------------<br>> <br>> Message: 6<br>> Date: Thu, 10 Sep 2009 07:56:30 -0400<br>> From: Bill Moran <wmoran@potentialtech.com><br>> Subject: Re: [wplug] DNS law?<br>> To: General user list <wplug@wplug.org><br>> Cc: Douglas Green <diego96@mac.com><br>> Message-ID: <20090910075630.e4f3ce7c.wmoran@potentialtech.com><br>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII<br>> <br>> In response to Douglas Green <diego96@mac.com>:<br>> <br>> > Hi Group-<br>> > <br>> > I understand that I'm not consulting an attorney by addressing your <br>> > guys, and that your opinions don't constitute legal advice, etc. <br>> > Nevertheless, many of you are pretty well informed regarding internet <br>> > and The Law. Besides that, you're all pretty sharp.<br>> > <br>> > Some weeks ago I had a horrible customer experience with an airline. <br>> > My issues were completely ignored by customer service, who actually <br>> > didn't return email or phone calls. My final step was to register a <br>> > domain name and put up a website, documenting the problems I've <br>> > experienced with this airline.<br>> > <br>> > The airline owns "theirname".com.mx, but does not own "theirname".com, <br>> > which is owned by some other travel-related company. I was able to <br>> > purchase "theirname".us, just in time for them announcing US flight <br>> > servce (previously, they only operated within Mexico).<br>> > <br>> > Today I got a cease/desist letter from a legal firm out of New York <br>> > stating that my website is defamatory, and that I must immediately <br>> > remove the website content AND give the airline company the Domain <br>> > Name!!!<br>> > <br>> > It's this second point that I'm asking your opinions on- If I own <br>> > airline.us, do I have to hand over the DNS to airline.com.mx who <br>> > apparently failed to secure the top domain space despite their <br>> > "tradename"? As far as the content being defamatory, AFIK if it's True <br>> > then it ain't Slander!<br>> <br>> Part of this boils down to "how much are you willing to spend to prove<br>> that you're right?" You can be totally in the right, but if you<br>> haven't got thousands or more to spend defending your position, the<br>> airline can use the court system to effectively win the case, simply<br>> because you'll have to back down.<br>> <br>> See http://www.potentialtech.com/cms/node/69<br>> <br>> That being said, I don't think they can "demand" the site back. If you've<br>> paid for it, they have a legal obligation to at least reimburse you for<br>> your expense. Again, is it worth thousands in lawyer fees to recoup a<br>> $25/year domain registration?<br>> <br>> However, on the rest of the points, I believe the others are correct.<br>> Based on precedents in other areas of trademarks, it's on _your_ shoulders<br>> to ensure that you're not wasting your money buying something that you<br>> can't use.<br>> <br>> Look at it this way: I open a restaurant and put a bit sign on it calling<br>> it "McDonalds" because I figure people will gravitate to that name. When<br>> "McDonalds evil corporation LLC" files a cease and desist order, would<br>> anyone be surprised or argue their right to do so? If I cry, "well, it's<br>> MECLLC's responsibility to reimburse me for the cost of the sign" will<br>> anyone care?<br>> <br>> The "I registered it first" mentality doesn't really stand up to US and<br>> other country's trademark law. Early on in the history of the internet<br>> there were some crazy things that happened with companies spending big<br>> $$$ to buy domain names that other people had scarfed first, but if you<br>> think about it, those were usually names like "business.com" which are<br>> not trademarkable.<br>> <br>> -- <br>> Bill Moran<br>> http://www.potentialtech.com<br>> http://people.collaborativefusion.com/~wmoran/<br>> <br>> <br>> ------------------------------<br>> <br>> Message: 7<br>> Date: Thu, 10 Sep 2009 14:02:29 +0200<br>> From: Yaakov Nemoy <loupgaroublond@gmail.com><br>> Subject: Re: [wplug] DNS law?<br>> To: General user list <wplug@wplug.org><br>> Message-ID:<br>> <7f692fec0909100502h41a881b5ie345a267aa497367@mail.gmail.com><br>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1<br>> <br>> 2009/9/10 Douglas Green <diego96@mac.com>:<br>> > Hi Group-<br>> ><br>> > I understand that I'm not consulting an attorney by addressing your<br>> > guys, and that your opinions don't constitute legal advice, etc.<br>> > Nevertheless, many of you are pretty well informed regarding internet<br>> > and The Law. Besides that, you're all pretty sharp.<br>> ><br>> > Some weeks ago I had a horrible customer experience with an airline.<br>> > My issues were completely ignored by customer service, who actually<br>> > didn't return email or phone calls. My final step was to register a<br>> > domain name and put up a website, documenting the problems I've<br>> > experienced with this airline.<br>> ><br>> > The airline owns "theirname".com.mx, but does not own "theirname".com,<br>> > which is owned by some other travel-related company. I was able to<br>> > purchase "theirname".us, just in time for them announcing US flight<br>> > servce (previously, they only operated within Mexico).<br>> ><br>> > Today I got a cease/desist letter from a legal firm out of New York<br>> > stating that my website is defamatory, and that I must immediately<br>> > remove the website content AND give the airline company the Domain<br>> > Name!!!<br>> ><br>> > It's this second point that I'm asking your opinions on- If I own<br>> > airline.us, do I have to hand over the DNS to airline.com.mx who<br>> > apparently failed to secure the top domain space despite their<br>> > "tradename"? As far as the content being defamatory, AFIK if it's True<br>> > then it ain't Slander!<br>> ><br>> > Thanks for your (non-legally binding) input! ;)<br>> <br>> IANAL here, but asking such advice is potentially illegal to respond<br>> to. None of us can give legally binding advice, and anything that we<br>> say could set a precedent against you that could backfire. In<br>> otherwords, you should really only ask a lawyer these questions. There<br>> may be ways out of this situation to your advantage, but i don't want<br>> to comment on them too deeply.<br>> <br>> Generally the rule is that if your domain violates some trademark,<br>> they have to enforce it by taking all legal action they can, and that<br>> means that they're probably going to get the trademark. As for the<br>> content and any other legal liability, and even the fact that another<br>> travel related company also uses the same trademark makes this<br>> entirely the domain of lawyers. Asking for real advice here is a<br>> really bad idea.<br>> <br>> -Yaakov<br>> <br>> <br>> ------------------------------<br>> <br>> Message: 8<br>> Date: Thu, 10 Sep 2009 08:37:32 -0400<br>> From: Bill Moran <wmoran@potentialtech.com><br>> Subject: Re: [wplug] DNS law?<br>> To: General user list <wplug@wplug.org><br>> Message-ID: <20090910083732.54e54a3c.wmoran@potentialtech.com><br>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII<br>> <br>> In response to Yaakov Nemoy <loupgaroublond@gmail.com>:<br>> <br>> > 2009/9/10 Douglas Green <diego96@mac.com>:<br>> > > Hi Group-<br>> > ><br>> > > I understand that I'm not consulting an attorney by addressing your<br>> > > guys, and that your opinions don't constitute legal advice, etc.<br>> > > Nevertheless, many of you are pretty well informed regarding internet<br>> > > and The Law. Besides that, you're all pretty sharp.<br>> > ><br>> > > Some weeks ago I had a horrible customer experience with an airline.<br>> > > My issues were completely ignored by customer service, who actually<br>> > > didn't return email or phone calls. My final step was to register a<br>> > > domain name and put up a website, documenting the problems I've<br>> > > experienced with this airline.<br>> > ><br>> > > The airline owns "theirname".com.mx, but does not own "theirname".com,<br>> > > which is owned by some other travel-related company. I was able to<br>> > > purchase "theirname".us, just in time for them announcing US flight<br>> > > servce (previously, they only operated within Mexico).<br>> > ><br>> > > Today I got a cease/desist letter from a legal firm out of New York<br>> > > stating that my website is defamatory, and that I must immediately<br>> > > remove the website content AND give the airline company the Domain<br>> > > Name!!!<br>> > ><br>> > > It's this second point that I'm asking your opinions on- If I own<br>> > > airline.us, do I have to hand over the DNS to airline.com.mx who<br>> > > apparently failed to secure the top domain space despite their<br>> > > "tradename"? As far as the content being defamatory, AFIK if it's True<br>> > > then it ain't Slander!<br>> > ><br>> > > Thanks for your (non-legally binding) input! ;)<br>> > <br>> > IANAL here, but asking such advice is potentially illegal to respond<br>> > to. None of us can give legally binding advice, and anything that we<br>> > say could set a precedent against you that could backfire. In<br>> > otherwords, you should really only ask a lawyer these questions. There<br>> > may be ways out of this situation to your advantage, but i don't want<br>> > to comment on them too deeply.<br>> > <br>> > Generally the rule is that if your domain violates some trademark,<br>> > they have to enforce it by taking all legal action they can, and that<br>> > means that they're probably going to get the trademark. As for the<br>> > content and any other legal liability, and even the fact that another<br>> > travel related company also uses the same trademark makes this<br>> > entirely the domain of lawyers. Asking for real advice here is a<br>> > really bad idea.<br>> <br>> Yes! Fleee!!! Hide in your homes!!! Be afraid of your own shadow!!!<br>> <br>> What a bunch of bull. In _The_Art_of_Unix_Programming_, Eric Raymond<br>> makes an excellent point about how people mindlessly flee from legal<br>> crap by constantly making claims like "I am not a lawyer" and refusing<br>> to answer legal questions. I agree with him that it's stupid to be<br>> afraid to discuss it. If you're going to take a stand in this (which<br>> I think is a bad idea) you'll _need_ a lawyer. However, talking about<br>> what it makes sense to do with people in general is fine. When the<br>> law makes it dangerous to discuss this kind of thing in public, we're<br>> all fucked.<br>> <br>> -- <br>> Bill Moran<br>> http://www.potentialtech.com<br>> http://people.collaborativefusion.com/~wmoran/<br>> <br>> <br>> ------------------------------<br>> <br>> Message: 9<br>> Date: Thu, 10 Sep 2009 08:53:45 -0400<br>> From: Christopher DeMarco <demarco@maya.com><br>> Subject: Re: [wplug] WiFi Parts Pgh<br>> To: General user list <wplug@wplug.org><br>> Message-ID: <20090910125345.GA27501@owl.prv.maya.com><br>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii<br>> <br>> On Fri Sep 4 09:23:16 2009 -0400, James LaSalle wrote:<br>> > Is there a store in the Pittsburgh/Cranberry area that sells WiFi <br>> > parts? When the Monroeville Mall hosted "computer shows" there were <br>> <br>> I don't know for sure, but the Graybar store over in the Northside<br>> might have what you need... but don't go tonight unless you like<br>> Steeler traffic :-)<br>> <br>> <br>> <br>> -- <br>> Christopher DeMarco <demarco@maya.com><br>> IT Director<br>> MAYA Group<br>> +1-412-708-9660<br>> <br>> <br>> <br>> ------------------------------<br>> <br>> Message: 10<br>> Date: Thu, 10 Sep 2009 08:56:24 -0400<br>> From: Christopher DeMarco <demarco@maya.com><br>> Subject: Re: [wplug] DNS law?<br>> To: General user list <wplug@wplug.org><br>> Message-ID: <20090910125624.GB27501@owl.prv.maya.com><br>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii<br>> <br>> On Thu Sep 10 08:37:32 2009 -0400, Bill Moran wrote:<br>> <br>> > Yes! Fleee!!! Hide in your homes!!! <br>> <br>> Dude! 90% of deaths occur in the home!! Please don't advocate such<br>> dangerous behavior on this list.<br>> <br>> <br>> -- <br>> Christopher DeMarco <demarco@maya.com><br>> IT Director<br>> MAYA Group<br>> +1-412-708-9660<br>> <br>> <br>> <br>> ------------------------------<br>> <br>> Message: 11<br>> Date: Thu, 10 Sep 2009 09:49:04 -0400<br>> From: Drew from Zhrodague <drew@zhrodague.net><br>> Subject: Re: [wplug] DNS law?<br>> To: General user list <wplug@wplug.org><br>> Message-ID: <4AA903D0.2040101@zhrodague.net><br>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed<br>> <br>> Christopher DeMarco wrote:<br>> > On Thu Sep 10 08:37:32 2009 -0400, Bill Moran wrote:<br>> > <br>> >> Yes! Fleee!!! Hide in your homes!!! <br>> > <br>> > Dude! 90% of deaths occur in the home!! Please don't advocate such<br>> > dangerous behavior on this list.<br>> <br>> Oh, Noes!<br>> <br>> Post the C&D, Doug. Post your URL on every related website you can <br>> find. Contact the webmasters, and ask them to post a link. Spread the <br>> word. Make a stink -- this is what the Internet is for.<br>> <br>> This may be a neat topic to discuss with other SEO folks, who may be <br>> interested in helping (like me, contact me off-list). I do hope yours <br>> ends up a success story!<br>> <br>> <br>> -- <br>> <br>> Drew from Zhrodague http://www.pghwireless.net<br>> drew@zhrodague.net http://dorkbot.org/dorkbotpgh<br>> http://www.WiFiMaps.com http://www.hackpittsburgh.org<br>> <br>> <br>> <br>> ------------------------------<br>> <br>> Message: 12<br>> Date: Thu, 10 Sep 2009 10:33:49 -0400<br>> From: Bill Moran <wmoran@potentialtech.com><br>> Subject: Re: [wplug] DNS law?<br>> To: General user list <wplug@wplug.org><br>> Cc: Drew from Zhrodague <drew@zhrodague.net><br>> Message-ID: <20090910103349.4ee7014b.wmoran@potentialtech.com><br>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII<br>> <br>> In response to Drew from Zhrodague <drew@zhrodague.net>:<br>> <br>> > Christopher DeMarco wrote:<br>> > > On Thu Sep 10 08:37:32 2009 -0400, Bill Moran wrote:<br>> > > <br>> > >> Yes! Fleee!!! Hide in your homes!!! <br>> > > <br>> > > Dude! 90% of deaths occur in the home!! Please don't advocate such<br>> > > dangerous behavior on this list.<br>> > <br>> > Oh, Noes!<br>> > <br>> > Post the C&D, Doug. Post your URL on every related website you can <br>> > find. Contact the webmasters, and ask them to post a link. Spread the <br>> > word. Make a stink -- this is what the Internet is for.<br>> > <br>> > This may be a neat topic to discuss with other SEO folks, who may be <br>> > interested in helping (like me, contact me off-list). I do hope yours <br>> > ends up a success story!<br>> <br>> It won't if you go that route.<br>> <br>> I mean, there's no reason you can't spread the news about what jerks this<br>> airline are. But, unless you're willing to fork out a bunch of money on<br>> lawyers, they're going to win the right to take the domain name off you.<br>> Even if you spend a bunch of money on lawyers, they'll still probably<br>> win it back.<br>> <br>> If you want to keep going the way you're going, I'd buy<br>> ${companyname}sucks.com, move your hate site to there, then send their<br>> lawyers a polite apology and an agreement to move the domain to their<br>> hands. Then document what assholes they are on your new site.<br>> <br>> If they bring a slander lawsuit against you, that's a different issue.<br>> Slander is completely different law than trademark law, and you have<br>> every right to make your story public if you feel the need. Law will<br>> uphold their right to keep control of their trademark, however.<br>> <br>> Of course, even if you have the right to put up a hate site, they can<br>> still sue you. Legally, anyone can sue anyone over anything, and if you're<br>> unable to put up the cash to stand up for your rights, they'll win simply<br>> by overwhelming you. So be prepared to fight back if you intend to keep<br>> bad mouthing them. In fact, it's probably worth spending a few $100 to<br>> talk to a lawyer before you proceed, just to get an understanding of what<br>> you can say and what you can't.<br>> <br>> -- <br>> Bill Moran<br>> http://www.potentialtech.com<br>> http://people.collaborativefusion.com/~wmoran/<br>> <br>> <br>> ------------------------------<br>> <br>> Message: 13<br>> Date: Thu, 10 Sep 2009 10:51:56 -0400<br>> From: Pat Barron <pat@tiderium.com><br>> Subject: Re: [wplug] DNS law?<br>> To: General user list <wplug@wplug.org><br>> Message-ID: <4AA9128C.80005@tiderium.com><br>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed<br>> <br>> As someone else pointed out, this all falls under the UDRP, which you <br>> can find here:<br>> <br>> http://www.icann.org/en/udrp/udrp-policy-24oct99.htm<br>> <br>> If you don't respond to their C&D, their next step (at least, one of <br>> their next steps) will probably be to file a UDRP complaint.<br>> <br>> Based on the circumstances you described, and UDRP precedent, if they <br>> file a complaint and it gets to an administrative proceeding, you would <br>> probably lose. You can look at past decisions in such matters here:<br>> <br>> http://www.wipo.int/amc/en/domains/decisionsx/index.html<br>> <br>> If an administrative proceeding determines that the airline's complaint <br>> against you is valid, the domain will be transferred to them. There is <br>> no obligation on the part of the airline, the registrar, or anyone else, <br>> to reimburse you for your registration fees, or any other expenses <br>> related to losing the domain name.<br>> <br>> The issue of defamation is a separate one, and yes, truth is an absolute <br>> defense against such a claim. But you really ought to talk to an <br>> attorney about that one, particularly if they seem to be making noises <br>> that they truly intend to pursue some kind of legal action.<br>> <br>> --Pat.<br>> <br>> <br>> Douglas Green wrote:<br>> > Hi Group-<br>> ><br>> > I understand that I'm not consulting an attorney by addressing your <br>> > guys, and that your opinions don't constitute legal advice, etc. <br>> > Nevertheless, many of you are pretty well informed regarding internet <br>> > and The Law. Besides that, you're all pretty sharp.<br>> ><br>> > Some weeks ago I had a horrible customer experience with an airline. <br>> > My issues were completely ignored by customer service, who actually <br>> > didn't return email or phone calls. My final step was to register a <br>> > domain name and put up a website, documenting the problems I've <br>> > experienced with this airline.<br>> ><br>> > The airline owns "theirname".com.mx, but does not own "theirname".com, <br>> > which is owned by some other travel-related company. I was able to <br>> > purchase "theirname".us, just in time for them announcing US flight <br>> > servce (previously, they only operated within Mexico).<br>> ><br>> > Today I got a cease/desist letter from a legal firm out of New York <br>> > stating that my website is defamatory, and that I must immediately <br>> > remove the website content AND give the airline company the Domain <br>> > Name!!!<br>> ><br>> > It's this second point that I'm asking your opinions on- If I own <br>> > airline.us, do I have to hand over the DNS to airline.com.mx who <br>> > apparently failed to secure the top domain space despite their <br>> > "tradename"? As far as the content being defamatory, AFIK if it's True <br>> > then it ain't Slander!<br>> ><br>> > Thanks for your (non-legally binding) input! ;)<br>> > -Doug<br>> ><br>> > PS- For the morbidly curious: www.volaris.us<br>> > _______________________________________________<br>> > wplug mailing list<br>> > wplug@wplug.org<br>> > http://www.wplug.org/mailman/listinfo/wplug<br>> > <br>> <br>> <br>> <br>> <br>> ------------------------------<br>> <br>> Message: 14<br>> Date: Thu, 10 Sep 2009 11:28:47 -0400<br>> From: Michael Semcheski <mhsemcheski@gmail.com><br>> Subject: Re: [wplug] DNS law?<br>> To: General user list <wplug@wplug.org><br>> Message-ID:<br>> <c077d2020909100828uda5bdc0g2e8eaffb2430725@mail.gmail.com><br>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"<br>> <br>> Thought this story was kind of apropo to today's discussion:<br>> <br>> http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/news/2009/09/can-a-mere-domain-name-be-defamation-glenn-beck-says-yes.ars<br>> <br>> Mike<br>> -------------- next part --------------<br>> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...<br>> URL: http://www.wplug.org/pipermail/wplug/attachments/20090910/a4640945/attachment-0001.html <br>> <br>> ------------------------------<br>> <br>> Message: 15<br>> Date: Thu, 10 Sep 2009 11:43:04 -0400<br>> From: Zachary Uram <netrek@gmail.com><br>> Subject: Re: [wplug] DNS law?<br>> To: General user list <wplug@wplug.org><br>> Message-ID:<br>> <ecfa260c0909100843g49acf192m22af445ad2e9ee03@mail.gmail.com><br>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8<br>> <br>> Glenn Beck is insane.<br>> <br>> Zach<br>> <br>> On Thu, Sep 10, 2009 at 11:28 AM, Michael Semcheski<br>> <mhsemcheski@gmail.com> wrote:<br>> > Thought this story was kind of apropo to today's discussion:<br>> ><br>> > http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/news/2009/09/can-a-mere-domain-name-be-defamation-glenn-beck-says-yes.ars<br>> ><br>> > Mike<br>> ><br>> > _______________________________________________<br>> > wplug mailing list<br>> > wplug@wplug.org<br>> > http://www.wplug.org/mailman/listinfo/wplug<br>> ><br>> ><br>> <br>> <br>> ------------------------------<br>> <br>> _______________________________________________<br>> wplug mailing list<br>> wplug@wplug.org<br>> http://www.wplug.org/mailman/listinfo/wplug<br>> <br>> <br>> End of wplug Digest, Vol 67, Issue 7<br>> ************************************<br><br /><hr />Windows Live: Make it easier for your friends to see what you’re up to on Facebook. <a href='http://windowslive.com/Campaign/SocialNetworking?ocid=PID23285::T:WLMTAGL:ON:WL:en-US:SI_SB_facebook:082009' target='_new'>Find out more.</a></body>
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