[wplug] The evilness of it all (Verizon OT post)

Shane Liesegang shane at shaneliesegang.com
Wed Aug 23 01:31:03 EDT 2006


That should have said a proverbial *punch.* Forgive my lack of 
proofreading.

	- SJML


Shane Liesegang wrote:
> Interesting that you would write something so inflammatory about 
> Pittsburgh to a predominantly Pittsburgh list, but then claim the last 
> word and that you didn't wish to start a flame war.
> 
> Sadly, I'm sure there will be myriad responses from those who disagree 
> with you.
> 
> I've never understood this tendency, to throw a (proverbial) and then 
> run away saying "I don't want to fight!" Seems to happen often on the 
> internet, with the "I don't want to start a flame war BUT" mentality.
> 
> Ah well. Just an observation, from a fellow Californian who enjoyed his 
> sojourn in Pittsburgh.
> 
>     - SJML
> 
> 
> Doug Green wrote:
>> Haha- I'm definitely not kidding. Furthermore, I'm not going to waste any
>> time "educating" anyone (maybe "convincing" is a better word, but I 
>> have a
>> hard time seeing it that way). In Shadyside you'll pay every penny of 
>> 1200
>> for a decent 690sf apartment, and then some. PLUS you'll have to pay
>> outrageous utility bills.
>>
>> Buy a home in the Burgh, go ahead. It'll cost 10x less than a comparable
>> home elsewhere. And in ten years, when "elsewhere" has appreciated 7-12%
>> annually, your Pittsburgh home will be worth roughly what you paid for 
>> it.
>> That's a great investment if you like to lose money. You're better off
>> stuffing your money in your mattress, at least there you won't be taxed
>> (HEAVILY) on it! Nor will you have to pay 17$/mcf to keep it warm!!
>>
>>> From now on, mum's the word from me regarding this topic because I 
>>> refuse to
>> be in a flame war. Honestly, if you like living there more power to you.
>>
>>
>> On 8/22/06 9:18 PM, "kimberly" <kim at starjewel.org> wrote:
>>
>>> You've got to be joking doug. I pay $1200/mo for a 690 sq ft 
>>> apartment in
>>> Sunnyvale. Real estate is the only thing that makes me want to move back
>>> home.
>>>
>>> On Tue, 22 Aug 2006, Doug Green wrote:
>>>
>>>> Yeah, it's pathetic. Even more pathetic is that Pittsburghers have done
>>>> NOTHING about the backyard monster for decades. The "don't hurt my 
>>>> boss"
>>>> mentality runs deep there- wake up, UPMC has had the city by the 
>>>> nads for
>>>> years.
>>>>
>>>> UPMC makes a majority of their money on real estate deals. 
>>>> Healthcare is,
>>>> indeed, a profitable venture- but the corporate giant has it's 
>>>> fingers in
>>>> deeper pockets as well.
>>>>
>>>> I'm afraid that the joke is on Pittsburgh. UPMC is the majority 
>>>> employer in
>>>> the region. UPMC is the largest landholder in the metropolitan city 
>>>> area.
>>>> UPMC is tax-exempt. To make up for the property taxes that are not 
>>>> paid by
>>>> UPMC, the city looks to you.
>>>>
>>>> I've lived a lot of places in my life- including places where "the 
>>>> taxes are
>>>> really high"- and I've NEVER paid so much for so little.
>>>>
>>>> I wasted 8 long years in the Burgh, hoping I'd see signs of change. 
>>>> I could
>>>> rail on and on about how pathetic that area is, but instead I chose to
>>>> LEAVE. I sold my house and got the hell out of there - and I took my 
>>>> two
>>>> doctorate degrees with me!
>>>>
>>>> If you've read this far, you might be thinking "good- leave if you 
>>>> don't
>>>> like it here". And that mentality is the exact reason that 
>>>> Pittsburgh is
>>>> losing, and will continue to lose, the highly trained young 
>>>> professionals.
>>>> Pittsburgh has done NOTHING to attract or retain them!!
>>>>
>>>> Food for thought: I now live 3 blocks from the beach in Southern 
>>>> California,
>>>> and my rent is LOWER than what I paid in Shadyside (8 years ago). 
>>>> Unlike
>>>> Shadyside, my utility bills are included. I get a personal retirement
>>>> savings plan instead of mandatory social security contributions. I 
>>>> get a
>>>> renter's tax deduction for my housing expenses. There is no "tax 
>>>> penalty"
>>>> for being employed within city limits. There's no city income tax. 
>>>> There's
>>>> no payroll tax.
>>>>
>>>> Yes, you are correct, there is something terribly wrong with 
>>>> Pittsburgh.
>>>> UPMC is a good start.
>>>>
>>>> Cheers from greener pastures,
>>>> Doug
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On 8/22/06 7:46 PM, "Zach" <netrek at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On 8/22/06, Brent M. Rust <rust at lucasware.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Maybe they figure that if the oil companies can make record 
>>>>>> profits then
>>>>>> they too can reap the benefits of a complacent public and little 
>>>>>> or no
>>>>>> competition.
>>>>> Read in P-G today that UPMC posted a 77% increase in profits for the
>>>>> past fiscal year ending July! That is insanity. They are now up to
>>>>> over $ 1/2 billion in PROFITS. Hmm let's see we have most expensive
>>>>> health care and universities in the world which an increasing number
>>>>> of people can't access (and no not just the poor or working poor, this
>>>>> is starting to hit the middle class), and then there is the equally
>>>>> trend where wages have remained largely stagnant for past 5 years,
>>>>> utility costs (electricity and natural gas) are soaring like e^x,
>>>>> gasoline prices are insane, etc. ad infinitum. Seems more and more
>>>>> people are working longer and harder to achieve a sub-standard quality
>>>>> of living compared to their parents or grandparents' generation.
>>>>> Wonder how far away we are from another big social inflection point.
>>>>> :-) At least Linux is still free!
>>>>>
>>>>> Zach
>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>>> wplug at wplug.org
>>>>> http://www.wplug.org/mailman/listinfo/wplug
>>>>
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