From jo2y at midnightlinux.com Tue Nov 5 13:59:00 2002 From: jo2y at midnightlinux.com (James O'Kane) Date: Tue, 5 Nov 2002 13:59:00 -0500 (EST) Subject: [wplug-web]new website initiative Message-ID: I'm going to try getting the website back up and working somehow. I'd like anyone who is interested in brainstorming to join the wplug-web mailing list. I'll organize more when I get back from LISA. For now, just send your brainstorming ideas on what features the new site could/should have, and we'll prioritize them later. Don't assume any languages (ie PHP, perl, java, etc.) or facilities (Postgresql, etc.) at this point. (This wasn't sent to the general list because I'd prefer to not have 100's of inactive participants.) -james From evand at wplug.org Tue Nov 5 14:05:51 2002 From: evand at wplug.org (Evan DiBiase) Date: Tue, 5 Nov 2002 14:05:51 -0500 Subject: [wplug-web]new website initiative In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <99F16CBE-F0F1-11D6-9BB6-00039319D3BC@wplug.org> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 I'm obviously game. - -Evan On Tuesday, November 5, 2002, at 01:59 PM, James O'Kane wrote: > I'm going to try getting the website back up and working somehow. I'd > like > anyone who is interested in brainstorming to join the wplug-web mailing > list. I'll organize more when I get back from LISA. For now, just send > your brainstorming ideas on what features the new site could/should > have, > and we'll prioritize them later. Don't assume any languages (ie PHP, > perl, java, etc.) or facilities (Postgresql, etc.) at this point. > > (This wasn't sent to the general list because I'd prefer to not have > 100's > of inactive participants.) > > -james > > _______________________________________________ > wplug-web mailing list > wplug-web at wplug.org > http://www.wplug.org/mailman/listinfo/wplug-web -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: PGP 8.0 (Build 288) Beta iQA/AwUBPcgWkizx06YZeciOEQIqyACfW0AItkhaQ4XM3p+Bg4uUB9DKg2AAniBz HatfTegiGebaa513+ov/5cnt =aeka -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From wplug at badgertronics.com Tue Nov 5 14:15:10 2002 From: wplug at badgertronics.com (Mark Dalrymple) Date: 5 Nov 2002 19:15:10 -0000 Subject: [wplug-web]new website initiative In-Reply-To: (jo2y@midnightlinux.com) References: Message-ID: <20021105191510.22350.qmail@above.badgertronics.com> > I'd like anyone who is interested in brainstorming to join the > wplug-web mailing list. Some stuff off the top of my head. Stuff we'd prettty much have to have: * time, date, location of current and upcoming GUMs, along with program (if any) * minutes from previous GUMs * whatever board-of-directors tools exist * email archives * random static content = mailing list info = IRC info and etiquette guide = maps to GUMs = James O'Kane fund information = bios and pictures of our board = pointer to MarkDude's LDP archives * breaking news Stuff that'd be cool: * instructional materials from past GUMs that folks are willing to let us put online * polls and surveys * personal home pages / blogs (with an appropriate terms of service policy) * a place for book reviews * a place for folks to publish random technical documents * screenshot of the moment * monkeybot's words of wisdom (random factoid) * everything searchable * a mentor/mentee dating service = person1: registers "i'm an oracle expert" on the site person2: queries "I'm having trouble installing Oracle" and emails person1 person1: emails "bring your machine to the next installpest and I'll work with you" * GUM member brag page = "mpop just got a job supervising the IT department of a major accounting firm" = "Billings teaches perl at LISA" = "markd2 hit by a bus" = "jo2y's kitchen sponsored" * monkeybot gateway ("monkeybot, when's the next gum?" "for the last time, i am not talking to you anymore!") * ecommerce, selling t-shirts, books, bumper stickers * local resources = like "what's a good local linux friendly ISP" (not alltel) = or "what's a half-decent ISP" (not alltel) = or "I am a sysadmin consultant who can code in C" ++Mark Dalrymple, markd at badgertronics.com. http://badgertronics.com "A large user community of hackers with operating system sources and no social lives are a tremendous asset; just look at Linux." -- Martin Frankel From eksortso at linuxmail.org Tue Nov 5 18:00:49 2002 From: eksortso at linuxmail.org (David Ostroske) Date: Tue, 05 Nov 2002 18:00:49 -0500 Subject: [wplug-web]Re: [wplug] new website initiative Message-ID: <20021105230049.6493.qmail@linuxmail.org> Here are some suggestions. A lot of dedicated locations, some new, some old... * A dedicated location for an image gallery (including the images from our old meetings, if we still have them). * A dedicated location for talk requests. That way, a speaker doesn't need to join wplug-plan just to ask to speak to our group. * A dedicated location for book reviews (to make O'Reilly, Wrox, and others happy). Comments should be allowed. * A dedicated location for old talks and supplementary materials, including links. * A dedicated location for organizational information: board members, bylaws, etc. * A dedicated location for preferred links. We could maintain our own DMOZ. * A dedicated location for software projects started or maintained by WPLUG members. Not SourceForge, but a meta-site for WPLUG projects. Show the outside world how we've been contributing to the world of software development! * A dedicated location for news, right on the center of the home page. * A dedicated location for classifieds. We could move the marketplace mailing list to the website. A good lure for newbies looking for hardware. Might require security clearance. * All email addresses are hidden. Only by entering a password can a user get another's email address. (Similar to how eBay keeps email addresses from prying eyes.) * Notification updates automatically every Sunday morning. The name of the scheduled talk or event should be included. Special events should also appear. --- David Ostroske eksortso at linuxmail.org -- Powered by Outblaze From zman at wplug.org Tue Nov 5 16:06:24 2002 From: zman at wplug.org (Zach Paine) Date: Tue, 5 Nov 2002 16:06:24 -0500 Subject: [wplug-web]new website initiative In-Reply-To: <20021105191510.22350.qmail@above.badgertronics.com> References: <20021105191510.22350.qmail@above.badgertronics.com> Message-ID: <200211051606.24017.zman@wplug.org> I'd definitely like to help. Mark I like a lot of the ideas that you came up. They sound uber-cool. Should we arrange for a (dinner?) meeting for those interested? -Zach On Tuesday 05 November 2002 02:15 pm, Mark Dalrymple wrote: > > I'd like anyone who is interested in brainstorming to join the > > wplug-web mailing list. > > Some stuff off the top of my head. > > > Stuff we'd prettty much have to have: > * time, date, location of current and upcoming GUMs, along with program > (if any) * minutes from previous GUMs > * whatever board-of-directors tools exist > * email archives > * random static content > = mailing list info > = IRC info and etiquette guide > = maps to GUMs > = James O'Kane fund information > = bios and pictures of our board > = pointer to MarkDude's LDP archives > * breaking news > > Stuff that'd be cool: > * instructional materials from past GUMs that folks are willing to let us > put online * polls and surveys > * personal home pages / blogs (with an appropriate terms of service > policy) * a place for book reviews > * a place for folks to publish random technical documents > * screenshot of the moment > * monkeybot's words of wisdom (random factoid) > * everything searchable > * a mentor/mentee dating service > = person1: registers "i'm an oracle expert" on the site > person2: queries "I'm having trouble installing Oracle" and emails > person1 person1: emails "bring your machine to the next installpest and > I'll work with you" * GUM member brag page > = "mpop just got a job supervising the IT department of a major > accounting firm" = "Billings teaches perl at LISA" > = "markd2 hit by a bus" > = "jo2y's kitchen sponsored" > * monkeybot gateway ("monkeybot, when's the next gum?" "for the last > time, i am not talking to you anymore!") * ecommerce, selling t-shirts, > books, bumper stickers > * local resources > = like "what's a good local linux friendly ISP" (not alltel) > = or "what's a half-decent ISP" (not alltel) > = or "I am a sysadmin consultant who can code in C" > > ++Mark Dalrymple, markd at badgertronics.com. http://badgertronics.com > "A large user community of hackers with operating system sources and no > social lives are a tremendous asset; just look at Linux." -- Martin > Frankel _______________________________________________ > wplug-web mailing list > wplug-web at wplug.org > http://www.wplug.org/mailman/listinfo/wplug-web From jaaronfarr at yahoo.com Tue Nov 5 18:28:33 2002 From: jaaronfarr at yahoo.com (J Aaron Farr) Date: 05 Nov 2002 18:28:33 -0500 Subject: [wplug-web]new website initiative In-Reply-To: <20021105191510.22350.qmail@above.badgertronics.com> References: <20021105191510.22350.qmail@above.badgertronics.com> Message-ID: <1036538915.1435.23.camel@localhost.localdomain> On Tue, 2002-11-05 at 14:15, Mark Dalrymple wrote: > > I'd like anyone who is interested in brainstorming to join the > > wplug-web mailing list. > > Some stuff off the top of my head. > ... > Stuff that'd be cool: > * instructional materials from past GUMs that folks are willing to let us put online > * polls and surveys > * personal home pages / blogs (with an appropriate terms of service policy) > * a place for book reviews > * a place for folks to publish random technical documents > ... I really like this list so far. A place to host HOW-TO's and other instructional material from the GUM would be really nice. A good link library would be nice, or at least some basic links for someone new. Perhaps an article or introduction to linux? Links to resources... It'd be nice if we could also integrate more with some the other Pittsburgh organizations. For example, offer to have a list of links on a page for companies that use linux in their business, or links to other computer related organizations in Pittsburgh. On the idea of home pages... What about links to open source or linux related projects that WPLUG members are involved in. Not that WPLUG would host the code or project, but at least point to projects WPLUG members are working on. Having Linux related news feeds on the front page (from slashdot or LWN) would be cool. I can definitely help with anything java related. I might also be able to wip up some artwork or articles for the new site too. jaaron From wplug at badgertronics.com Tue Nov 5 20:06:54 2002 From: wplug at badgertronics.com (Mark Dalrymple) Date: 6 Nov 2002 01:06:54 -0000 Subject: [wplug-web]new website initiative In-Reply-To: <200211051606.24017.zman@wplug.org> (message from Zach Paine on Tue, 5 Nov 2002 16:06:24 -0500) References: <20021105191510.22350.qmail@above.badgertronics.com> <200211051606.24017.zman@wplug.org> Message-ID: <20021106010654.24913.qmail@above.badgertronics.com> Hey gang, I needed a break from my current toil, so I whipped up some pages where folks can contribute ideas about the wplug.org site, and also express (dis)interest in a particular idea. I've added David's and my ideas. it's honor system voting (hey, what do you expect for less than an hour's work?) I reserve the right to summarily nuke anything that's off topic. http://badgertronics.com/wplug/newsite/ Cheers, ++Mark Dalrymple, markd at badgertronics.com. http://badgertronics.com "If not for the efforts of the Japanese, our language would still lack that amazingly handy "-zilla" suffix." -- unknown From jo2y at midnightlinux.com Wed Nov 6 23:01:11 2002 From: jo2y at midnightlinux.com (James O'Kane) Date: Wed, 6 Nov 2002 23:01:11 -0500 (EST) Subject: [wplug-web] new website initiative In-Reply-To: <20021106135809.32183.qmail@above.badgertronics.com> Message-ID: Now that I have a bit more time, I wanted to clarify some things a bit. I'm hoping to run this website as a formal project, using the things I learned a tutorial Monday. (http://www.usenix.org/events/lisa02/tutorials/tutmon.html#M13) Until I digest the tutorial info a bit more, I'm going to suggest that we just keep things at a brainstorming level. I'll plan a meeting with an appropriate agenda in the next few weeks, and we can break the project into parts. -james From rdale at wplug.org Thu Nov 7 12:08:15 2002 From: rdale at wplug.org (Robert Dale) Date: Thu, 7 Nov 2002 12:08:15 -0500 (EST) Subject: [wplug-web] new website initiative In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On Wed, 6 Nov 2002, James O'Kane wrote: > I'm hoping to run this website as a formal project, using the things I > learned a tutorial Monday. > (http://www.usenix.org/events/lisa02/tutorials/tutmon.html#M13) > > Until I digest the tutorial info a bit more, I'm going to suggest that we > just keep things at a brainstorming level. I'll plan a meeting with an > appropriate agenda in the next few weeks, and we can break the project > into parts. I think you'll see different project managements approaches for different kinds of projects. A SysAdmin's project management methods may be less than optimal for software development. I've been praticing eXtreme Programming techniques and now think it's the greatest thing for software projects. While I think project management is all well and good, I've found a successful project depends more on one of two things - 1) a critical mass of coders using the same language or 2) someone who has the time and energy to at it alone. I'm not trying to detract your goals, but without either of those, all the project management effort in the world isn't going help. Just my $0.02 -- Robert Dale From wplug at badgertronics.com Thu Nov 7 12:53:35 2002 From: wplug at badgertronics.com (Mark Dalrymple) Date: 7 Nov 2002 17:53:35 -0000 Subject: [wplug-web] new website initiative In-Reply-To: (message from Robert Dale on Thu, 7 Nov 2002 12:08:15 -0500 (EST)) References: Message-ID: <20021107175335.14125.qmail@above.badgertronics.com> rob-- sez: > 1) a critical mass > of coders using the same language or 2) someone who has the time and energy > to at it alone. I tend to agree. A lot will depend on who comes on board, who will actually have the time to contribute, and also the feature set desired. Plus someone to ultimately make the hard decisions once it comes down to platform, tools, features, etc. How about we have a Web Sig beating after the December GUM? We can guage folks' time and interest, and maybe start batting around tool, feature, and design issues. Who knows, maybe by that time I'll have an openacs prototype working :-) ++Mark Dalrymple, markd at badgertronics.com. http://badgertronics.com "FOR THICKER OATMEAL USE LESS WATER. FOR THINNER OATMEAL USE MORE WATER" -- Quaker Oats From evand at wplug.org Thu Nov 7 13:33:40 2002 From: evand at wplug.org (Evan DiBiase) Date: Thu, 7 Nov 2002 13:33:40 -0500 Subject: [wplug-web] new website initiative In-Reply-To: <20021107175335.14125.qmail@above.badgertronics.com> Message-ID: <6FA236DC-F27F-11D6-A595-00039319D3BC@wplug.org> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On Thursday, November 7, 2002, at 12:53 PM, Mark Dalrymple wrote: > > rob-- sez: >> 1) a critical mass >> of coders using the same language or 2) someone who has the time and >> energy >> to at it alone. > > I tend to agree. A lot will depend on who comes on board, who will > actually have the time to contribute, and also the feature set > desired. Plus someone to ultimately make the hard decisions once it > comes down to platform, tools, features, etc. Agreed. > How about we have a Web Sig beating after the December GUM? We can > guage folks' time and interest, and maybe start batting around tool, > feature, and design issues. I'd like to do this. It can be much easier to discuss design ideas in a [b m]eating than online, and, also, it provides for a bit more structure. In other words, I am still interested in doing this, I think XP (eXtreme Programming, not Windows) makes sense, and we need to get together in person to figure out how all of this good stuff integrates. > Who knows, maybe by that time I'll have an openacs prototype working > :-) Ooh, you temptress you! - -Evan -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: PGP 8.0 (Build 288) Beta iQA/AwUBPcqyByzx06YZeciOEQIL6wCgoeXapPLeMddqjroqRVxgiq4YM9oAn0QP yECI+BDwBitOGsaQAg7plE9Q =5QD9 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- From jo2y at midnightlinux.com Thu Nov 7 15:01:09 2002 From: jo2y at midnightlinux.com (James O'Kane) Date: Thu, 7 Nov 2002 15:01:09 -0500 (EST) Subject: [wplug-web] new website initiative In-Reply-To: <6FA236DC-F27F-11D6-A595-00039319D3BC@wplug.org> Message-ID: Off-hand I don't remember all the parts of XP programming, but I think of of the reasons LAIN didn't happen was because the scope was too big. I'm hoping to break the project down into appropriate sized tasks, and define the dependancies and goals. The only part of XP that I remember is writing the tests first and then write the code to pass the tests. What are some of the other applicaible? -james From wplug at badgertronics.com Thu Nov 7 15:03:04 2002 From: wplug at badgertronics.com (Mark Dalrymple) Date: 7 Nov 2002 20:03:04 -0000 Subject: [wplug-web] new website initiative In-Reply-To: (jo2y@midnightlinux.com) References: Message-ID: <20021107200304.15178.qmail@above.badgertronics.com> > The only part of XP that I remember is writing the tests first and then > write the code to pass the tests. What are some of the other applicaible? Pair programming. Merciless refactoring. Always have a working veersion of the system. Have close contact with the client. Tracking features throgh user stories. Release early, release often. Calculate 'velocity' (basically function points per unit time) based on previous week's performance and scale estimates accordingly. there's a a bunch of other stuff I'm forgetting. ++Mark Dalrymple, markd at badgertronics.com. http://badgertronics.com "I'm sure you're probably interested in hearing our analysis of the new laptops that were announced yesterday, but it's hard to concentrate on that when there's a naked energy being running around yelling 'Wheeeeeeeeee! Ha-ha! Whoooo-hooooo!'" -- John Moltz From jeremy at gunix.net Fri Nov 8 11:34:34 2002 From: jeremy at gunix.net (Jeremy Dinsel) Date: Fri, 8 Nov 2002 08:34:34 -0800 (PST) Subject: [wplug-web] new website initiative In-Reply-To: Message-ID: James said just what I was thinking while reading through the thread(s). Some goals that I think should be defined first and formost is: o Always know what component you are working on o Design the components so that they can be deployed incrementally Being able to release a small subset of the final project will give the developer a sense of accomplishment and will keep them focused. o Track bugs o Track feature requests o Prioritize o Stop digressing (and listing the obvious) Taking my own advice, I'll stop building on that list. I'd like to make my last point clear; once the feature set is defined, put it into bugzilla--one entry per component, even one entry per feature of a large component. Assign the tasks to individuals (or let them take it on their own). -j On Thu, 7 Nov 2002, James O'Kane wrote: : Date: Thu, 7 Nov 2002 15:01:09 -0500 (EST) : From: James O'Kane : Reply-To: wplug-web at wplug.org : To: wplug-web at wplug.org : Subject: Re: [wplug-web] new website initiative : : Off-hand I don't remember all the parts of XP programming, but I think of : of the reasons LAIN didn't happen was because the scope was too big. I'm : hoping to break the project down into appropriate sized tasks, and define : the dependancies and goals. : The only part of XP that I remember is writing the tests first and then : write the code to pass the tests. What are some of the other applicaible? : : -james : : : _______________________________________________ : wplug-web mailing list : wplug-web at wplug.org : http://www.wplug.org/mailman/listinfo/wplug-web : -- - Jeremy Dinsel - somewhere in the monkey house